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Saturday Night Racer >> SATURDAY NIGHT RACER >> new cause and collect rule
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Message started by Perrin on 08/21/06 at 8:20am

Title: new cause and collect rule
Post by Perrin on 08/21/06 at 8:20am

Does any one have a good explanation of the new cause and collect rule?

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by woodracin13 on 08/21/06 at 8:50am

If you cause a caution you are put to the back. If you are collected in the yellow you are sent to the back.
That is my understanding of it.

So, if you get caught up or someone spins in front of you stand on it and hope you make it through so you don't get sent to the back. Thats what do
.......LOL......J/K.........

Later,
Jacky

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by imracin68j on 08/21/06 at 8:56am

just like nascar

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by dirtboxhero on 08/21/06 at 10:17am

its good rule, but just like everything in racing there are 2 sides to it, we kinda got the short end of the stick on sat. with that new rule...but other than that i like the rule...it takes the judgement call out of the equation.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by R.Denman14 on 08/21/06 at 2:47pm

So I guess if someone takes you out (accident or not, or if your leading the race), you go to the back???????

Just trying to get a heads up before this weekend.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Jason_V on 08/21/06 at 3:21pm

Just in case you are in 2nd right Rich? lol

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by fromthegrandstands on 08/21/06 at 6:54pm

hmmm,

Sounds like 3rd place is a good place to run

2nd spins the leader, both go cause one caused, the other was collected...3rd place WINS.... YEAH~

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by TIM_BEWLEY on 08/21/06 at 7:12pm

R.Denman14 wrote on 08/21/06 at 2:47pm:

So I guess if someone takes you out (accident or not, or if your leading the race), you go to the back???????

Just trying to get a heads up before this weekend.

that is the way they say it is. takes the judgement call out.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by imracin68j on 08/21/06 at 8:04pm

think about it like this. If theres a pile up and the yahoo in front of you cant get through it and you do, you get the position cause your tallent prevailed. You deserve it.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by lmfan01 on 08/21/06 at 8:18pm

second did not take out the leader . He took out a lapped car. then they put him to the back. Pounds won do to Buck Cox cheating . . .

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Perrin on 08/21/06 at 8:51pm

so if a car spins close enough so that you can't avoid contact it's better to push him out of the way? after all he caused it and he didn't collect you.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by the_dirt_hurt on 08/21/06 at 9:04pm

I wonder what the insurance companies think of guys racing through crashes in order to not lose their position. Yikes! If the rule is remotely close to napcar is not a good move.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by woodracin13 on 08/21/06 at 9:20pm

Thats what I was saying just drive through them...lol...

I know Saturday in the Hobby Stock main I was like 10th or so I don't know but there was a pile up on the top and luckily I am a bottom feeder and got past about 6 or seven cars because they all were collected in one guys cause of spinning I don't know who caused it or who was collected but I know that I missed it and ended up forth on the restart. Worked good for me but would hate to be the one that got collected.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by DaveBauerSS6 on 08/21/06 at 9:25pm

the_dirt_hurt wrote on 08/21/06 at 9:04pm:

I wonder what the insurance companies think of guys racing through crashes in order to not lose their position. Yikes! If the rule is remotely close to napcar is not a good move.

AGREED

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Perrin on 08/21/06 at 9:29pm

take two guys that are mad at each other and put them together in the back so they can get even. that should be entertaining for the fans. another thought, a car that bumps and spins another car requires a judgment call to be assigned the cause. wasn't avoiding judgment calls the reason for thew new rule?

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by racermick on 08/21/06 at 10:22pm

That is just what happened to you last race at SMS Rich!

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by R.Denman14 on 08/21/06 at 10:41pm

racermick wrote on 08/21/06 at 10:22pm:

That is just what happened to you last race at SMS Rich!

Yah Larry but I was the only one that went to the back, oh well guess the officals cant see everything.

The new rule goes back to how Kings Speedway ran their shows in the Swindell era. I'm used to it but want to make sure everything and everybody is clear on it.
Only real bad thing is the leader is not protected from somebodys aggressive driving and gets a long waited win taken away.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by racermick on 08/21/06 at 10:45pm

I hear ya' Rich, good racing to you this weekend!

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by R.Denman14 on 08/21/06 at 10:53pm

racermick wrote on 08/21/06 at 10:45pm:

I hear ya' Rich, good racing to you this weekend!

Thanks Larry, see you in a couple of weeks at SMS.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by imracin68j on 08/21/06 at 11:41pm

like I always say, it's bad racing luck to get caught up in a wrecks just like it's bad racing luck to pull a bad pill. That rule does suck when you start up front. When your starting 10th back playing follow the leader its not so bad. Stay out of trouble and move up through the pack.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by imracin68j on 08/21/06 at 11:44pm

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by racermick on 08/22/06 at 6:43am

Luck is the by-product of skill and preparatioin !

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by imracin68j on 08/22/06 at 7:34am

agreed, skill and preparation should get you through the wrecks.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Geoff30 on 08/22/06 at 8:06am

Just to add to what Jacky was talking about saturday in the hobby race when they had the parking lot in 3&4 I went from 18th to 6th. So DONT STOP(or hit anything but that is more of a general rule)

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by snoopy22 on 08/22/06 at 9:45am

yeah dont stop because even if your not actully involved in the accident and you stop short you too will be sent back just like michael johnson and brian terry. neither one of them touch a car that was involved in the accident but because they stopped before hitting the cars they where still considered part of the pile up!!!

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by BALLJNTBUSTER32 on 08/22/06 at 10:05am

Saturday night was the worst Hobby race I've seen all year. Up until this race their has been alot of respect towards each of the drivers. #39 Brian Knight spun, Tina breaked to avoid collision. She actually stopped before hitting Brian, but because of the new rule "nobody" behind her ever lifted they thought they could just power through. Tina now knows to drive through the wreck, what ever you do don't slow down. I feel sorry for the teams that can't afford this. This is some what a begginer class still. Like Billy says skill will get you thru the wrecks. Maybe in the upper classes. JMO Richie

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by dirtboxhero on 08/22/06 at 1:05pm

the rule is good but its bad, we were runnin right in front of brian knight during that hobby race and i dont know what happened with his car but he decieded to turn right when he should have turned left... we got collected and sent to the back....if you get collected the rule sucks but if you stay out of everything its great....

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by chad11 on 08/22/06 at 2:29pm

No matter what the rule is, your goal is to avoid the wreck. Don't change that. Richie if your gonna tell Tina to power through the wrecks, she isn't gonna learn anything that will help her in the super street. But.... I'm sure Dave B. won't mind the extra $$$$ he'll get out of it. People complained when the rule was "no collection". Now people are still complaining. I hope the speedway staff is well compensated because they have to put up with alot of sh!t. QUIT COMPLAINING and just have fun.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by 17t_racer on 08/22/06 at 2:30pm

a good explination is it SUCKS!!! i got caught up in it on sat.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by dirtboxhero on 08/22/06 at 2:36pm

its easier this way on the officials because there is no judgement call...you cant say thats crap because he/she should have gone to the back for that and didnt....now if you hit or get hit your in the back no ands if's or buts about it. takes judgement out of the equation

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by chad11 on 08/22/06 at 2:53pm

I think the officials were put in a position to change this rule because of people complaing about them playing favorites. This way, they cannot be accused of this. I think it is one of them "be careful what you wish for" deals.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by dirtboxhero on 08/22/06 at 3:23pm

haha...very true chad, it doesnt matter what decision is made in racing....any change made will be good for some and bad for others, not one change everyone will agree on...

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by 17t_racer on 08/22/06 at 3:25pm

it just sucks when you are on the wrong end of it.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by dirtboxhero on 08/22/06 at 3:31pm

oh definantly our car was in front of the 39 and we got taken, but i guess the point is that you cant be mad at the officials, only the other drivers for you getting put in the back. it keeps the officials noses clean

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by mama68 on 08/22/06 at 3:39pm

this cause and collect thing seems to be blowen out of proportion. First of all I doubt that anyone that cares about their equipment is going to be plowing thru anything. And as far as the 2nd place taking out the 1st place, just remember that by doing this you have a 50/50 chance of taking yourself out, so why do it.

Cause and collect for as long as I can remember was, if you cause or get collected up in a wreck which stops your forward motion, you go to the back. It shouldn't mean if you spin to avoid a wreck and don't make contact with anyone, or you graze a car going by that is spinning, but don't stop your forward motion, these are not considered collected in a wreck.

This rule has been around for alot of years, and it just takes common sense on the officials part as to who caused and or got collected up in a wreck, and common sense and skill on the drivers part, not to push the issue and tear up equipment.

There is one other issue, I heard about, and am not sure I understand it correctly. If anything comes off your car, you have to go to the back. This is something that if it is true, needs to be rethought, or clarified better. Officials have to remember that we are on dirt, and things happen beyond your control, and it does not seem very logical to say if ANYTHING falls off your car, you go to the back.

We have got to put the OUTCOME OF A RACE, back to the SKILL OF THE DRIVER to set up their car, drive the track, drive the traffic, and with luck and ability be able to avoid wrecks,for a good finish, and not constant and questionable official rulings, which I can forsee as happening if these two rules are not handled carefully.

Please don't get me wrong, I am not bashing the officials, because I feel they have done an awesome job trying to handle things as they come up, and have been very fair as far as working with all of us. All I'm saying is that nothing is black & white, and incidents should be handled according to their circumstansies..

I have got to say, I am very proud of the way the SS have been racing. Tight competitive racing, but still showing respect for their fellow drivers. Not intentionally taking each other out and tearing up each others equipment

Oh well just my opinion
Sandie

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by 17t_racer on 08/22/06 at 3:40pm

true, the officials were doing what they were told to do!

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by JSD on 08/22/06 at 3:50pm

Mama68 said,

"There is one other issue, I heard about, and am not sure I understand it correctly. If anything comes off your car, you have to go to the back. This is something that if it is true, needs to be rethought, or clarified better. Officials have to remember that we are on dirt, and things happen beyond your control, and it does not seem very logical to say if ANYTHING falls off your car, you go to the back"

In the past I have seen cars put to the back for parts off of their car only if a yellow is thrown for the danger of that object on the track.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by robbySAWYER on 08/22/06 at 4:14pm

lets race with no cautions....!!!! ya know just if u get in a wreck you just wait till the race is over, thats fare right?

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by lmfan01 on 08/22/06 at 6:53pm

SHUT UP SAWYER you have NO idea what you are talking about !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by robbySAWYER on 08/22/06 at 8:47pm

hahahah

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Jason_V on 08/22/06 at 8:50pm

Hey cocky I mean Robby how did you do at Irwindale's twin SLM races? Did you repeat that 2nd place finish?

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by mama68 on 08/22/06 at 8:52pm

wrote on 08/22/06 at 4:14pm:

lets race with no cautions....!!!! ya know just if u get in a wreck you just wait till the race is over, thats fare right?

my my if it isn't "Our Rebel Without A Cause "

I've really missed your comments.....lol

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by robbySAWYER on 08/22/06 at 9:10pm

hahaha i was bored... i think its a great rule... simple as that... i dont see what the big deal is... everyone has to complain all the time... its a rule.. just go bye it

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by TIM_BEWLEY on 08/22/06 at 9:23pm

2Xhobby wrote on 08/21/06 at 8:18pm:

second did not take out the leader . He took out a lapped car. then they put him to the back. Pounds won do to Buck Cox cheating . . .

cause and collection

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Perrin on 08/22/06 at 9:58pm

well I was parked on the bumper that fell of the car right in front of me and he restarted in the same spot. quess he forgot to put the chain safety straps on. now is that rule different on a first lap restart?

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by bakoracer8 on 08/23/06 at 6:33am

The caution was credited to someone else more than likely.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by BALLJNTBUSTER32 on 08/23/06 at 7:18am

Chad11 wrote on 08/22/06 at 2:29pm:

Chad you obviously miss understood me. #39 Brian spun right in front of Tina. She braked to avoid hitting him. Had she just tapped or drove thru his rear end she would of made it thru easily, he was already spun out. But she didn't, she braked and got freight trained by the cars behind her that were trying to power thru. With this new rule sometimes you will have to drive thru the wreck in order to miss the big pile up. Which I'm not sure is a good thing. Bottom line rules are rules. I know Tina will prosper by this rule when her turn comes. Chad you have got to admit last week was as wild as the Hobbies have been all year. And the sad thing is, not everybody can afford to go see Dave B when their car gets wadded up. We'll be ok with this rule. It's just going to take a little time to get used to. Richie

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by lmfan01 on 08/23/06 at 4:41pm

i dont agree Richie that happened right in front of everybody. there was no place to go but the bottem and everyboby was going so fast that they did not have time to think.... So from 5 th or 6 th on back to about 13 th was in the crash. It sucks but it happens

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by BALLJNTBUSTER32 on 08/23/06 at 9:21pm

Your right there was no where to go, but if Tina had drove thru Brian when he was spinning, Tina might not of been collected. It really don't matter Tina finished 3rd. The more I've thought about this rule, I agree with it. This class is so even may be we will have different winners each week. Now it's who has the best luck and who can avoid the big wreck. Richie

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by bakoracer8 on 08/24/06 at 4:12pm

Everyone keep in mind that if you blast through a wreck we no longer pull sheetmetal away from tires. Getting through a pile-up is going to rely on a great deal of driving ability and heads-up thinking. Remember you should be looking several cars ahead to see what is going on. Good luck.

Mike

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by ERIC on 08/24/06 at 6:59pm

Sounds like the old WINSTON tire commercial, you can stop on a dime!Not.

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by 17t_racer on 08/24/06 at 7:57pm

"Remember you should be looking several cars ahead to see what is going on. Good luck. "
Hey Bakoracer8,
me and mike johnson were looking several cars ahead and stopped several cars before the wreck and we still got sent to the back!!!

Title: Re: new cause and collect rule
Post by Perrin on 08/25/06 at 8:58am

they way the rule was explained is that if you don't make contact but stop to avoid the wreck you keep your spot. but it sounds like from the race that wasn't how it happened a lot of the time. is this more of the judgment controversy were the racer sees something different than the track? bakoracer8 what do you think?