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Saturday Night Racer >> RACE TECH >> Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
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Message started by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 11/15/12 at 7:56am

Title: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 11/15/12 at 7:56am

The Street Stock (hobby) rules at Perris require us to weigh in at 3400 lb. The 1 800 Loan Mart race has a weight limit of 3300 lb.

I currently have 51.2 rear percent with a total weight of ~3450 lb (full fuel w driver).

I can lose 50 lb but it will cost me 1% rear weight. I can lose 100 lb and it will cost me approx 2% rear weight. My question is... Is it worth it?

Should I stay heavy and keep my rear % or should I go on a diet and go nose heavy?

CD

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by prochampion on 11/15/12 at 9:36am

Rear weight equals forward bite your car has ran good at PAS as is I would concentrate on what your car wants more than over all weight. On our car after we achieved our target % then we started removing weight equally jmo

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by propit21 on 11/15/12 at 10:20am

Going to need the rear weight comes main event time when the track is dry and slick

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by mudslinger47 on 11/15/12 at 7:17pm

Rick Fringer told me when it comes to weight and percentages, he'll go with percentages everytime. I suppose thats with in reason, but thats what he said. I know Clay runs a little heavy all the time, more then 50 lbs for sure. Well clarify, not Clay per say, the car...

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by childressJr.16 on 11/15/12 at 7:23pm

come main event time ILL take MORE REAR weight any day especially in the HOBBIES

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by ObertelloRacing on 11/15/12 at 7:32pm

Right the first time Duane, Clay is a % or 3 heavy........1% of a 3400 lb car is 34 lbs so, 100 lbs is 3% take of as much weight as possible cut chop whatever get the car weight as little as possible then add ballast to get your % right. It takes horsepower to get that weight moving and springs shocks and brakes to get to go around the track.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by TALON75 on 11/16/12 at 12:46am

Find a way to lose 25lbs up front, then you can take 25 off the rear(or leave it). I like percentages before overall wieght, but if you can get both obviously that is ideal.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 11/16/12 at 1:11pm

Thanks for all the advice. I will opt for rear weight over weight reduction for this race.

I will have to see about putting the car on a diet in the off season.

Thanks again.

CD

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by dirtmopar44 on 11/17/12 at 2:02pm

Not knowing were your wt is in the chassis if you remove any wt take the wt that is still there and move it up. This is the best article I have ever read on wt. http://www.circletrack.com/techarticles/weight_management_parts_placement_tech/ Good luck Curtis

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by pete166 on 11/18/12 at 8:47am

Dietzsch_Racing25 wrote on 11/15/12 at 7:56am:

FWIW I would say your rear % is ok for a heavy track a little light for the slick , I would work @ getting the rear % up to 54-56 % with more side bite or RR # for the slick rubber down

Most of the tin toppers will scream but you need to set up a SS more like a Sprint Car to really make em fast

Think about it LM/Modifieds are fast with the 4 bar rear steer set up as it is a different way to make it turn left vs stagger with a Sprint Car but they essentially accomplish the same thing

In a SS you do not have the rear steer of a LM/Mod you are more straight up on rear axle steer as a Sprint Car

So if you work in the direction of a Sprint Car set up in a SS you may find that the car will much faster & easier to drive ?

It does take a little time to get it worked out (as with everything there are no magic cures )but if you stay with it you might be surprised the direction it takes you

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by JOHNSON_22c on 11/26/12 at 1:57pm

Our hobbies are up around 56 57% 53 left and 40 pounds left rear heavy at 3300 pounds total

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 11/26/12 at 4:22pm

JOHNSON_22c wrote on 11/26/12 at 1:57pm:

Our hobbies are up around 56 57% 53 left and 40 pounds left rear heavy at 3300 pounds total

That is very impressive. I don't know how you guys do it!!!

If I trimmed 130 lb off of the front and bolted it on to the rear that would get me to 55% at 3450. I can't imagine how to get 130 lb off the front of the car. And I'd have to lose another 75 lb off the front end if I wanted 55% at 3300lb.

I know I have to do something if I want to be competitive. It is time for a new front clip anyway so I will see what I can do.

Thanks again all for the info.

CD

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by imracin68j on 12/30/12 at 1:18am

Take the rf brake off, cut the rotor off. Make sure you have the light camaro spindles. Take the lf rotor and have it machined down thin. That will probably grab you a percent believe it or not. I add weight but my dad always said never add weight to a car. I'd like to say I'm right and he was wrong but he was a lot smarter than me.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by mudslinger47 on 12/30/12 at 7:23pm

I kinda agree with you Billy, at least you get to put that weight where you want it.

Years ago when I was racing in the hobby class, we had a guy that ran his car with out any front bars, nothing except what little he needed to hold the fenders up and the radiator in. Car was fast and he won a championship. Jerry Vogt owned the car but the driver eludes me right now. Jerry's opinion was, don't hit anything and it won't be a problem.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by OLD SCHOOL#6 on 12/30/12 at 9:22pm

Larry Schlagel -- (sp?)

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by mudslinger47 on 12/31/12 at 12:02am

Yup, thats it!!

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by formercrewguy on 12/31/12 at 7:19am

OLD SCHOOL#6 wrote on 12/30/12 at 9:22pm:

Larry Schlagel -- (sp?)

That was back in the t-shirt with cigs rolled up in the sleeve days. lol

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by mudslinger47 on 12/31/12 at 4:26pm

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^truff^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Many moons ago ;)

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by over4t on 01/03/13 at 7:43am

The ex had both....an extra 50 pounds and a lot of rear percentage.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by formercrewguy on 01/03/13 at 8:42am

over4t wrote on 01/03/13 at 7:43am:

The ex had both....an extra 50 pounds and a lot of rear percentage.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by mudslinger47 on 01/04/13 at 8:12pm

over4t wrote on 01/03/13 at 7:43am:

The ex had both....an extra 50 pounds and a lot of rear percentage.

:o ;)

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 01/07/13 at 5:13pm

mudslinger47 wrote on 12/30/12 at 7:23pm:

Jerry's opinion was, don't hit anything and it won't be a problem.

I was not very successful at this last year but still very good advice.

Billy, I don't have the lighter spindles. I will see if I can get some (79-81 camaro right?).

CD

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 01/17/13 at 11:41am

Okay...

No that Perris has reduced it min weight from 3400 lb to 3200 lb I have to put the car on a serious diet. Any suggestions on how I might loose 200 lb (at the front of the car if possible)?

CD

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Chad11 on 01/17/13 at 2:48pm

Curtis, I don't know of anyone at Bako that is at 3200. I was at 3240 at the start of the year but I am right at 3300 now. I think it is more difficult to "put a car on a diet" than to think about weight when building it in the first place. Do you have an aluminum body? Going from steel to aluminum will save close to 60#'s. If you run an alternator or sway bar, get rid of them. stock mini starter? just a few things.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 01/17/13 at 5:38pm

Chad11 wrote on 01/17/13 at 2:48pm:

Yes I agree diets are much more difficult than biulding them light. I don't expect that I will be able to take 200 lb off (which would get me to 3250) but I just don't want to leave any reasonably priced stone unturned.

I am putting a new front clip and hoop so hopefully I can do a good job of making the new hoop and front bumper light yet strong. Hopefully I can lose a little more by redoing the dash and cutting a little on the firewall.

I am gonna lose the alternator. I am considering aluminum panels (at least hood, front fenders and doors). I hadn't thought of a mini starter.

Billy suggested lighter camaro spindles (if I can find them) and turning the rotors.

Are there exhaust manifolds that I can get that will save me some weight?

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Chad11 on 01/17/13 at 10:18pm

I'm not sure about the manifolds. There are lighter spindles, but they are not something I will spend time searching for if I already have a set. The main down bars of my front hoop are 1 1/2" x .095. My radiator/ fender supports are .065. I made a tube front bumper but it isnt much lighter than an aluminum bumper. You should skin the fire wall completely and build your dash out of aluminum. My brother just posted some pics of his car. It's very similar to mine. You should take a look for some ideas.

Title: Re: Is 50 lb worth 1% ?
Post by Dietzsch_Racing25 on 01/21/13 at 9:07am

Chad11 wrote on 01/17/13 at 10:18pm:

The Johnson family certainly builds beautiful cars.

Thanks for the suggestions. I looked under the dash and it looks like there is more stuff than I realized under there.

CD